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Lets Talk Obd3


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So what have people heard about OBD3.

Are any of the new vehicles using it yet?

Are the codes out yet?

What are the biggest differences between OBD 2 and 3?

Are the readers/programmers out yet?

Different connectors/pinouts?

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OBD III: The Motor Law Realized


You know that “check engine” light on your dashboard? What if instead of just telling you that the car’s computer has detected some fault with the emissions control system, it told the government – via roadside readers and satellite uplinks?

It’s called OBD III – and it’s right around the corner.

All new cars built since the mid-1990s have OBD II – or On Board Diagnostics II. This system standardized diagnostics by specifying that every new car come equipped with an OBD port (usually located somewhere near the driver’s side kick panel, on the underside of the dashboard) into which a technician (and your state’s emissions test station) can plug a scanner that downloads stored “trouble codes.” It is these trouble codes that also trigger the yellow “check engine” malfunction indicator light on your dash.

Mostly, these codes involve problems with the emissions control system rather than the engine itself. They’re often intermittent and minor. This is why it’s possible to continue driving the car with the “check engine” light on and everything still seems ok.

And it’s why the Powers That Be want OBD III.

In the words of the Specialty Equipment Manufacturer’s Association (SEMA), the vast umbrella organization representing automotive industry parts and equipment suppliers, OBD III is “A program to minimize the delay between detection of an emissions malfunction by the OBD-II system and repair of the vehicle.”

And how will that be accomplished? Rather than merely store trouble codes, OBDII will immediately transmit those trouble codes to The Man – who will then proceed to first warn you (via letter or e-mail) to have the car repaired, stepping up to more aggressive enforcement if you fail to do so in the form of “citations… court and/or DMV penalty at next registration.”

It would also be possible to send the info directly to any nearby cop, who would then pull you over immediately – saving the government some time while making some more money off motorists.

This is not sci-fi. It’s impending reality. All the technical issues have been solved. Most new cars already come with GPS systems capable of receiving and sending data. It would be a simple matter to salt the roads with scanners capable of ID’ing every car that passes by, automatically establishing a communications link with your car’s computer. This would occur continuously and constantly, too – not just every once-in-a-while. OBD III as envisioned would literally make it possible to constantly monitor and record every vehicle so equipped, from the moment it left the driveway to the moment it returned at night.

Here it is, straight from the horse’s mouth – the California Air Resources Board (CARB) which sets the trend for what inevitably becomes national when it comes to emissions rigmarole:

“If the inspection process could be automated through the use of transponder-assisted on-board diagnostic systems (in what could become an OBD-III requirement or program), the process could be made less costly and time-consuming.. ” (Italics added.)

If it comes to pass, OBD III will be the keystone that assures the end of any expectation of privacy behind the wheel (in addition to everywhere else) and it will also obviate the quaint notion that it’s your car – and hence, private property. Hence, hands off. SEMA’s fact sheet about OBD III notes this directly, stating that OBD III would impose what amounts to “sanctions based on ‘suspicionless mass surveillance’ of private property” and would also be “random,” with the actual monitoring taking place before the computer throws any codes – and so, bereft of probable cause and thus a pretty clear violation of the Fourth Amendment.

But, the Fourth Amendment is already a dead letter. It has been trumped – trampled – numerous times, on the basis of generalized, potential “threats” – everything from potential drunks (which now means anyone who happens to be behind the wheel on a public road) to potential polluters, whose cars might be emitting more than the allowable maximum amount of fumes (or even just CO2).

That’s how it will shake out, rest assured.

And it gets better, too.

If it becomes The Law that all new cars must be equipped with scannable OBD III, then what about older cars without OBD at all?

Here is the backdoor that will be used to effectively outlaw older cars, including antique cars – but also just older late-model cars. They won’t be prohibited outright, probably. Rather, they will be prohibited from being used for everyday transportation. You’ll be allowed to keep your pre-OBD III car. You just won't be allowed to drive it – except, perhaps, to the occasional old car show.

Or they may just require that all pre-OBD III cars be “retired” after a certain period – and then rendered inoperable by having their engines filled with silica or some such, a la Cash for Clunkers.

In this way, everyone will be forced into the system of mass control/mass surveillance. It has been a source of frustration in certain quarters that it’s still possible for the average citizen to drive a car built before catalytic converters and computers (and air bags and all the rest of it) became mandatory or de facto mandatory. There are dangerous asocial types out there who prefer such cars, which are paid-for, simpler and can often be kept running for years for next to nothing. That annoys both the TPTB – and probably also the car industry, which wants you in a new car, not a paid-for older car. The big combines will be among the most ardent proponents not merely of OBD III – but that cars without OBD III be “retired.”

The same arguments used to justify all the other gang bangs of the Fourth Amendment will be trotted out: We must protect the “safety” of the public – a public that increasingly becomes supine and moist at the mere mention of the Pavlovian cue word, safety.

And it will be impossible to argue against, because the essential argument has already been conceded. We have no individual rights worth discussing – and hence, no rights to either privacy or property that may not be set aside at any moment by some broadly asserted collective interest – as defined by the small minority that operates the collective.

When I was kid in the ’70s I liked the rock band, Rush. One song in particular, titled Red Barchetta – in honor of one of the first Ferrari street cars. The song was about a bleak future time, after a Motor Law banning private cars had been passed.

That future is just about here, unfortunately.

Reprinted with permission from EricPetersAutos.com.

February 3, 2012

Eric Peters [send him mail] is an automotive columnist and author of Automotive Atrocities and Road Hogs (2011). Visit his website.

Copyright © 2012 Eric Peters

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for gods sake, cant they keep their ******* nose out of our business?


pretty soon, they'll tax us a quarter per breath.

$had3 :ford::merc:others-261.gif

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So where exactly is the source for this crap? Because there are a lot of retarded conspiracy theories to be read out there on the internet, and this "article" is no more credible than any of the others without some kind of valid citations for what he's claiming... rolleyes.gif

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I think ODB-III is just a myth. It's been talked about for over years with no real development. OBD-II is sufficient enough :)

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I know for sure in the next year or 2 all commercial diesel engines will be on a single system, my buddy who is currently training to be a diesel tec informed me of this. Currently every company has their own system requiring mechanics to own every type of tool if they want to be able to diagnose a problem, he mentioned that International/navistar has their own computers that you buy from them.

And I would believe every thing that is said above, the government thinks they know best, look at New York city, Bloomberg thinks that big sodas are bad so he just outlaws it. They think guns are bad they will take them away, they think we abuse our RIGHT to own and drive a car of our choice as many miles as we want...so they will make it harder for us. The problem starts with electric cars and hybrids, the government has figured out that they are not getting their fare share of tax from fuel sales, people can drive tons of miles on hybrids without burning any fuel, I bet within my lifetime they will tax us based on the amount of miles we drive, by using their up link to these new connectors. The fact that our highway systems are ageing and failing is also a big factor, they will essentially PUNISH those who drive more and cause more wear to the roads. You just wait and see. It will start small but give it 50 years.

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Credible or not, I have two things to say:

1. California, which pretty much says it all right there.

2. Let's see them try and remove me from Marilyn and Sally. I dare 'em.

Now, not that it really matters, because by the time they set this in motion, the country will be in collapse ANYWAY due to the sharp dive that the economy will be taking withing the next few months. Won't be any electricity, gas, diesel, or anything to run our cars regardless.

I can get into it more, but I won't at this point due to the nature of this forum.

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You're really gonna sit there and call someone ignorant?

Let's put it this way:

If I'm wrong, and TS doesn't HTF, then all my preparing is for naught, right? Right. But I still have necessities stockpiled, and they can be used anyway.

If YOU'RE wrong, and TS DOES HTF, then you, my friend, are up s**t creek with no paddles and a hole in your boat.

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Watch out for "Them" to sic OBD3 on you, Rusty. I hear it can even listen to your thoughts from four traffic lanes away. unsure.gif I read that on the internet so it has to be legit.


others-261.gif Hey, if Pennsylvania's s**t does hit the fan, just go ahead and light one up to wait out the whackjobs.

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So where exactly is the source for this crap? Because there are a lot of retarded conspiracy theories to be read out there on the internet, and this "article" is no more credible than any of the others without some kind of valid citations for what he's claiming... rolleyes.gif

This article comes from concerns generated by the fact that institutions in California ARE talking about crafting a viable OBD 3 system exactly for the purpose of controlling everyone's lives even more.

Here is a link from SEMA - a VERY credible organization.


It reads much the same and raises red flags to me about those who desire the implementation of OBD 3 and the resulting installed overseers intentions to control.

I don't want more control from the government entering my life, and I applaud those who would shoot at talk of planning to add more controls. This article shoots at that talk.


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Nobody "Says" anything is done yet - it's all talk at this point.

But some of the talk from those who would control me is unsettling.

I want to see this nonsense die at the talk stage, and so do a lot of other people.

Are you FOR this type of privacy invasion planning?

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The only people talking about this are those who believe unsubstantiated rumors. I can find someone online claiming that California is going to invade the other 49 and make us all learn to speak Portugese. Doesn't make it something that we need to take seriously.

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Some asshat in California has talked about this already. That makes it a discussion, not a rumor. Discussions turn into plans, plans turn into laws that I don't want.

I believe that a staged implementation plan, which the gov't uses time and time again (let's call it progressive), is already feasible using what is now common equipment on many newer vehicles.

I don't like this discussion right there. I'm not worried about retrofitting older cars, they'll go away on their own as 95% of owners will just use them up and junk them.

No need to even pipe dream about further "if's" as the takeover advances. The first step is one too many for me.

The California invasion bit is beneath you, IMO. Desperate irrational grab at unequal parity. California can't pay it's own cops, how are they going to field an army big enough to attack an ant hill?

C.A.R.B., however, is real and now and a huge pain in the a$$ with overreaching power already.

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Are you FOR this type of privacy invasion planning?

You never answered my question.

Do you feel it is ok for a cop to swing around and pull you over because your car just sent him a text saying your secondary air pump didn't run for a full 30 seconds this morning when you started the car to go to work?

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I still don't see OBD-III coming out anytime soon. It'd be many years until, the only article is that SEMA one, and that's being republished on a university server, probably because SEMA dropped the article because the idea probably died for OBD-III.

Other than that, and forums, I don't see much about OBD-III.

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It's definitive proof of a conspiracy when no one knows about it, though... right? :P

Look, to paraphrase 'The Simpsons': OBD-III, like the boogeyman or Michael Jackson, is one of those things that people can bring up to mess with those others who are scared enough to fall for it.

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I still don't see OBD-III coming out anytime soon. It'd be many years until, the only article is that SEMA one, and that's being republished on a university server, probably because SEMA dropped the article because the idea probably died for OBD-III.

Other than that, and forums, I don't see much about OBD-III.

But you are saying it was discussed? If the idea died, you mean someone voiced an idea in the first place? I accept that as believeable. Someone voiced the idea.

And Brian STILL hasn't answered my question.


Yes or No. No more dodging.

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What makes you even think that I might say 'Yes'? rolleyes.gif Of course not.

But I don't need to waste time arguing over what a completely hypothetical scenario might lead to. It doesn't matter what you're afraid OBD-III could be in the future because "some people" had an idea a decade ago. It doesn't ******* exist, not in the form described in the old SEMA paper or in any other form for that matter. You're just being overly paranoid for the sake of having something imaginary and scary to prepare for.

As someone who works in the health industry... that s**t just ain't healthy for you, man. sleep.gif You're better off just building a camo tent to hide from FEMA's black helicopters. laugh.gif

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