Jump to content

Welcome to Taurus & Sable Owners' Club

Welcome to Taurus & Sable Owners' Club!
If you are not a member, registering to our forum is easy! To get immediate access to everything we have to offer, click here to register and get started! If you're already a memeber, sign in here.

Registering gives you access to:
  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates
  • List your car in the Garage for everybody to see your car and it's mods
  • Get your own profile and make new friends
  • Buy and sell parts in the Marketplace
  • Take part in the car meets and events each year
  • And much more!
Guest Message © 2014 DevFuse

How To Adjust Timing On A Messed Up Engine?


  • Please log in to reply
14 replies to this topic

#1 SoNic

SoNic

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 202 posts
  • Location:Virginia, USA
  • TSOC Chapter:Southeast
  • TCCA Name:SoNic67
  • My Car:1996 Mercury Sable
  • Engine:Duratec V6 3.0


Users Awards

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:22 PM

This is my wife's Hyundai Sonata V6 2.5L. Seems like every 35-40k miles the timing belt breaks. Fortunately, even if they say it is an interference engine, never did damaged the pistons/valves. Always happened in the driveway (like today).
So, when I crank the engine it spins really fast. Now, all the timming is messed up. How do I align again the marks in this case.
Firing order is 1, 4, 2, 5, 3, 6. Cylinder numbering is 1, 3, 5 by firewall, 2, 4, 6 by radiator.
My plan:
1. Rotate the crankshaft until cylinder #1 is at top.
2. Rotate the camshaft gear on the cyl #1 bank until I get both (actually all 4) valves closed. This should be in the location when the marks on gear line-up. Do I need to take the valve covers off to do that or I can feel it with the finger in the plug hole?
3. Rotate the other bank gear till... now I am lost. What cylinder should be at top compression now?

#2 steveg1988

steveg1988

    Devoted Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,257 posts
  • Location:NJ USA
  • TSOC Chapter:Mid-Atlantic
  • TCCA Name:steveg1988
  • My Car:2003 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS
  • Engine:2.4L 4G64 16V SOHC 4 Cyl


Users Awards

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:48 PM

I have never done timing, but from what i understand, there are timing marks on all 4 cams, and the crank, having the crank at TDC as well as the cams will give you perfect timing.

#3 Vash

Vash

    Northern Pres/ Resident Car Hoarder

  • Platinum Members
  • 2,523 posts
  • Location:Paynesville, MN
  • TSOC Chapter:Northern Central
  • My Car:00 Sable LS, 97 Sable LS
  • Engine:Duratec X2


Users Awards

Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:08 PM

Your best bet is to find what Hyundai's procedure is. Each car is a little different. Most have timing marks, or in the case of a 95-97 zetec contour you must pull the cam cover and put in a special camshaft holding device to align them.

Chris V. Paynesville, MN Northern Chapter President    Is There Really Such A Thing As Too Many Cars??
~ 00 Sable LS Premium - Chestnut Brown - Roush Springs, Magnaflow Exhaust, SHO Seats, HIDs, and Much More
~ 04 Volvo S60R AWD - Titanium Gray/Sand Gobi - 300HP Turbo Inline 5 6-speed Manual winter beater - Broken :(
~ 02 Cougar Sport "Hello Cougar"

~ 97 Contour SE - SVT Clone

~ 92 Ranger 4X4 ~ 78 Ranchero 500 ~ 77 RamCharger ~ 04 P71 


#4 TaurusKev

TaurusKev

    Post Whore

  • Platinum Members
  • 4,490 posts
  • Location:Schaumburg, IL
  • TSOC Chapter:Midwest
  • My Car:89 T-Bird SC 1995 Taurus LX Wagon and Thunderbird LX
  • Engine:3.8L Essex V6 Supercharged, 3.8L Essex V6 NA, and 4.6L Modular V8


Users Awards

Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:26 PM

Your best bet is to find what Hyundai's procedure is. Each car is a little different. Most have timing marks, or in the case of a 95-97 zetec contour you must pull the cam cover and put in a special camshaft holding device to align them.


Lol, my "special" timing tool was a small sheet of wood I trimmed to fit the camshafts :lol:

Give me the year of her Sonata, and I can see if my version of Mitchell has the car, and if so, I'll get you the information you need ;)
LFSW
I've always been mad
I know I've been mad
Like the most of us, it's very hard to explain why you are mad even if you're not mad.

People embrace mediocrity. That's why the Camry sells so well.


#5 jw89sho

jw89sho

    Devoted Member

  • Platinum Members
  • 1,361 posts
  • Location:Fayetteville, TN
  • TSOC Chapter:Eastern Central
  • TCCA Name:jw89sho
  • My Car:89 Taurus SHO / 99 Escort SE
  • Engine:3.0 Yamaha DOHC / 2.0 Ford DOHC VCT


Users Awards

Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:42 PM

Posted Image

Should be something like this. Need year to get the specific diagram, and the VIN code for the engine would help as well (eighth letter).
-Josh

89 Taurus SHO / Yamaha 3.0 24v DOHC - 99 Escort SE / Zetec 2.0 16v DOHC - 05 Suzuki GSX-R600 / 16v DOHC

If you switch gears over 5k during a solar eclipse you'll have to have your nut bearings revalved. There is a lot that goes into it. Same goes for making a sammich.

#6 three50one

three50one

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 670 posts
  • Location:Gettysburg PA
  • TSOC Chapter:Not Enrolled
  • My Car:07 9-3 Aero Sportcombi, 85 XR4Ti, 88 Tbird
  • Engine:2.8t, 2.3t, 2.3t

Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:54 PM

Is it bad I know the mechanical timing procedure by heart on the 2.3 turbo Ford motors? I also know which motors computers get 10 and 13 degrees. I also know the voltage the TPS is supposed to sweep at after you set all of that.

On a serious note. That's a Delta engine like the Tiburon had. 2.5 vs 2.7 but the procedure may be the same. Maybe check out a tiburon forum.

#7 SoNic

SoNic

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 202 posts
  • Location:Virginia, USA
  • TSOC Chapter:Southeast
  • TCCA Name:SoNic67
  • My Car:1996 Mercury Sable
  • Engine:Duratec V6 3.0


Users Awards

Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:24 PM

It is 2000 V6 2.5L. All the procedures of replacing a GOOD belt rely on timing markings when cyl 1 is at TOD. In my case, the belt is not good anymore so I have to know if the markings can still be used since two crank rotations can fit to that position.

Edited by SoNic, 15 October 2012 - 09:35 PM.


#8 jw89sho

jw89sho

    Devoted Member

  • Platinum Members
  • 1,361 posts
  • Location:Fayetteville, TN
  • TSOC Chapter:Eastern Central
  • TCCA Name:jw89sho
  • My Car:89 Taurus SHO / 99 Escort SE
  • Engine:3.0 Yamaha DOHC / 2.0 Ford DOHC VCT


Users Awards

Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:33 PM

Just align all the marks and you will be in business. The crank rotates twice for each rotation of the cam(s), so there will be 2 points where it will line up.
-Josh

89 Taurus SHO / Yamaha 3.0 24v DOHC - 99 Escort SE / Zetec 2.0 16v DOHC - 05 Suzuki GSX-R600 / 16v DOHC

If you switch gears over 5k during a solar eclipse you'll have to have your nut bearings revalved. There is a lot that goes into it. Same goes for making a sammich.

#9 SoNic

SoNic

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 202 posts
  • Location:Virginia, USA
  • TSOC Chapter:Southeast
  • TCCA Name:SoNic67
  • My Car:1996 Mercury Sable
  • Engine:Duratec V6 3.0


Users Awards

Posted 16 October 2012 - 01:48 AM

Soo... how would I know at which one of the two possible rotations I am? Because only one of the rotations is the "right" one (compression on cyl #1).

#10 Vulcanator

Vulcanator

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 872 posts
  • Location:Cranbrook, BC
  • TSOC Chapter:Canada and Alaska
  • TCCA Name:spock power
  • My Car:1999 Ford Taurus SE
  • Engine:3.0 Vulcan


Users Awards

Posted 16 October 2012 - 05:23 AM

If I'm thinking right as long as cyl 1 is at tdc it doesn't matter. It will only matter if the timing belt were attached. Two rotations of the crank for one rotation of the crankshaft, so as long as the marks are lined up you can put the belt on.

#11 Vash

Vash

    Northern Pres/ Resident Car Hoarder

  • Platinum Members
  • 2,523 posts
  • Location:Paynesville, MN
  • TSOC Chapter:Northern Central
  • My Car:00 Sable LS, 97 Sable LS
  • Engine:Duratec X2


Users Awards

Posted 16 October 2012 - 07:57 AM

Exactly, so long as the mark is lined up and cylinder 1 is at tdc it doesn't matter what stroke it is on.

Chris V. Paynesville, MN Northern Chapter President    Is There Really Such A Thing As Too Many Cars??
~ 00 Sable LS Premium - Chestnut Brown - Roush Springs, Magnaflow Exhaust, SHO Seats, HIDs, and Much More
~ 04 Volvo S60R AWD - Titanium Gray/Sand Gobi - 300HP Turbo Inline 5 6-speed Manual winter beater - Broken :(
~ 02 Cougar Sport "Hello Cougar"

~ 97 Contour SE - SVT Clone

~ 92 Ranger 4X4 ~ 78 Ranchero 500 ~ 77 RamCharger ~ 04 P71 


#12 -chart-

-chart-

    Post Whore

  • Gold Member
  • 2,952 posts
  • Location:Upstate NY
  • TSOC Chapter:Not Enrolled
  • My Car:2003 Sable LS 2001 Sable LS Wagon, '02 Lin Cont
  • Engine:Duratecs Both


Users Awards

Posted 16 October 2012 - 09:49 AM

Exactly, so long as the mark is lined up and cylinder 1 is at tdc it doesn't matter what stroke it is on.


Good call.
With the timing belt off, every stroke is the same on the crank.
And the cam.

Once they are belted, then they have the pattern.

-chart-

#13 jw89sho

jw89sho

    Devoted Member

  • Platinum Members
  • 1,361 posts
  • Location:Fayetteville, TN
  • TSOC Chapter:Eastern Central
  • TCCA Name:jw89sho
  • My Car:89 Taurus SHO / 99 Escort SE
  • Engine:3.0 Yamaha DOHC / 2.0 Ford DOHC VCT


Users Awards

Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:22 AM

Good call.
With the timing belt off, every stroke is the same on the crank.
And the cam.

Once they are belted, then they have the pattern.

-chart-


As soon as you line up all the marks, the engine will be on compression for #1 cylinder.
-Josh

89 Taurus SHO / Yamaha 3.0 24v DOHC - 99 Escort SE / Zetec 2.0 16v DOHC - 05 Suzuki GSX-R600 / 16v DOHC

If you switch gears over 5k during a solar eclipse you'll have to have your nut bearings revalved. There is a lot that goes into it. Same goes for making a sammich.

#14 SoNic

SoNic

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 202 posts
  • Location:Virginia, USA
  • TSOC Chapter:Southeast
  • TCCA Name:SoNic67
  • My Car:1996 Mercury Sable
  • Engine:Duratec V6 3.0


Users Awards

Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:36 AM

Thanks, I was confused. That's easier than I was thinking.

#15 SoNic

SoNic

    Regular Member

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 202 posts
  • Location:Virginia, USA
  • TSOC Chapter:Southeast
  • TCCA Name:SoNic67
  • My Car:1996 Mercury Sable
  • Engine:Duratec V6 3.0


Users Awards

Posted 17 October 2012 - 06:39 PM

Now... I can see the belt. Not broken or "jumped" teeth.
So my guess was wrong - based on previous experience. When I did crank the engine, it spinned faster than usually (like some valves would be open) but didn't start.

Edited by SoNic, 17 October 2012 - 07:46 PM.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users